Comments on: Thank You for Not Touching My Baby

By: Misty

Misty — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 01:15:00 +0000

Duchess,
I read that same study in National Geographic, last year (I think, don’t remember exactly) and it said that allergies are a first world illness because of our clean houses and filtered air. Their biggest point was that we need to get our kids outside as much as possible.

Everybody else (especially Seth),
Thanks for a great discussion. Once again, I never know what will generate a lot of discussion and it tickles me when everyone is talking here. Thanks!

By: Chris

Chris — Tue, 25 Sep 2007 17:03:03 +0000

Seth,

To paraphrase Dickens in “A Christmas Carol”, If they are wont to die let them do so and thus decrease the surplus population.

I’m curious if you consider yourself part of the surplus population “problem”?

As for kids messing with public food, I totally agree — I cannot stand people who let their children attack a buffet by themselves because I have seen them pick up corn on the cob and then put it back in the buffet tray. However, I have also encountered some adults of questionable hygiene practices in places such as weddings and I wonder if you find people of all ages to be an issue or if you really do limit it to children.

By: Missy Krebs

Missy Krebs — Tue, 25 Sep 2007 15:37:48 +0000

If you don’t want children, it’s great that you recognize that and don’t have any. But they shouldn’t be viewed as some societal burden. They are society. They have every right that every other human being has. And that includes the right to eat at restaurants as long as their parents are paying for it.

And I do think we should be glad that there are some people out there raising kids who will educate them and raise them to be productive people. I’m grateful Misty and Stephen had two children who they will raise to respect other people and have valuable skills to share with the rest of the world.

By: duchess

duchess — Tue, 25 Sep 2007 13:22:03 +0000

You know, Lucian reminded me of an article in a pediatrician journal I read a while back (my aunt is a pediatrician and a lot of her mail comes to us) - about how one of the reasons there are so many incidences of asthma and allergies in kids now as opposed to 20 years ago is because kids are not being exposed to *enough* germs. The reasoning was that humans lived in fairly germy-environments in the past, and our bodies have built-in mechanisms for fighting the germs off. Now we live in fairly clean environments (not talking about the hyper-clean), but our bodies are still equipped with the fighting mechanism, and because it’s looking for things to fight, it ends up attacking stuff that’s not dangerous, causing allergies. (Oversimplification and lots of paraphrasing, but you know what I mean)
I hadn’t thought about it in this way before, but maybe I shouldn’t be flinching my son out of the way of hands. Dunno. Some of those people who want to touch him are downright CREEPY.

By: Lucian Smith

Lucian Smith — Tue, 25 Sep 2007 02:20:18 +0000

To bring the discussion back to babies, another aspect to the whole thing is that the most recent studies seem to indicate that we’re designed to encounter a lot of germs for the first two years of life, and that avoiding them can mess things up. The most recent study I’ve heard about showed a link between decreased exposure to dirt as an infant, and a increased incidence of childhood diabetes.

By: vika

vika — Mon, 24 Sep 2007 22:33:40 +0000

*shrug* Seth, you seem to have expressed three problems, one of which I share with you.

One is, you don’t want arrogant humans informing you that not wanting children is a “phase.” UGH, I’m with you there.

Then, you don’t want children in or near your stuff. Fine, and your prerogative, but it’s a different problem from the one above. Confusing the two is liable to get people upset.

Three is, you think voluntary population decrease is a good idea, and here lie pretty significant social problems that, if you ignore them, will get us (the world) into a massive hole economically and politically. Again, this is a different problem from the two above, and — you’re probably right, for another forum. But it’s distinct from any personal feelings an individual may have about children as humans.

By: seth vidal

seth vidal — Mon, 24 Sep 2007 22:23:31 +0000

Vika,
I won’t get into it here but it’s not just about population, It’s about carrying capacity. We’re in massive overshoot.

There are better places for this conversation. So I won’t respond to anything beyond this.

-sv

By: vika

vika — Mon, 24 Sep 2007 22:09:49 +0000

Seth,

Overpopulation is a myth. Do play with the Google Gapminder, and for a lot more information you can always do a Google search for “overpopulation myth”. See particularly this article and this one.

By: seth vidal

seth vidal — Mon, 24 Sep 2007 21:59:53 +0000

If breeders could keep from uttering the “You’ll change your mind someday” cliche that seems to be loved by parents all over the world then I think I’d be a lot less bitter about it.

By: Stephen

Stephen — Mon, 24 Sep 2007 21:51:05 +0000

Ah, gotcha. That I can understand, though as a breeder I obviously don’t subscribe to the viewpoint myself. But I also differ from Missy above, since I don’t think you should be grateful I’m having kids.